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What is included in the price ?
Posted November 19th, 2009 - 7:28 pm by from London, England (Permalink)
Hello, maybe it is improper question. But I was looking for any details for what you want so much money, and I didn't find. So is it possible to write in details what is included in the price. Because maybe I didn't understand something but writing for example for 40 euro is

6-day package without accommodation, online payment
(350 places in total; includes NYE party, T-Shirt, visits events, discounts etc )

and

Both include:

- the NYE party
- the events (unless it is noted by the event)
- lots of fun
- discount vouchers for various places in Budapest


what does it mean?
- do we pay for the service on the nye or for the place, or for what exactly?
-events... for which events exactly? for every event? what if i want to go not for all
- lots of fun is in the price (for sure:D)
-vouchers i understand but for various places what does it mean? which places.
- or maybe in the price is the cost of producing wrist bands? :>

It would be nice of you to write in details, because I am confused about it. and don't now what exactly i have to pay for.

Posted November 20th, 2009 - 12:37 am by from Budapest, Hungary (Permalink)
Hi Isabella,
the list of events is not finalized yet, kindly see the main event and the list of sub events, these are getting continuously updated.. expect to have a final version and the very detailed list in a good week from now..

we want to keep it simple... there will be certain days 2 - 3 events at the same time so it will be impossible to join every event still we have decided to charge a flat fee..

but please do not buy anything that you are not convinced of meaning a good value for money!!

See you soon in Budapest!!
cheers Andras



Posted November 20th, 2009 - 10:43 am by from London, England (Permalink)
Thanks for your answer, but if i dont need place to sleep, I would like to know for what I have to pay 40 euro ? For a trains, for tickets? For entries, for you, or for what? Maybe for a dj?

It is just paying without any information. I would really like to know.

Posted November 20th, 2009 - 11:27 am by from Budapest, Hungary (Permalink)
Witaj Isabelo!
your ticket price goes to the Hungarian Couchsurfers Association a registered non profit organisation.
the fees cover the organisational costs of materials, T shirt production event room rentals, djs -- one american 4 locals , IT infrastructure , food for the goulash workshop etc tec., wrist band production mobele phone cards. security costs,
the ticket /wrist band entitles you to participate on all published events publishe under the sub meetings of the main events.
5 discount coupons to bath houses, discount on the 3 days Budapest card , the Memento statue park , hot wine etc etec..
but pls let us stop here, and do not tell us what you do not need.
we have hundreds of e mails to answer! thanks for your understanding and see you, do widzenia w Budapeszcie! pozdrowinia Andras

Posted November 20th, 2009 - 6:49 pm from Brive-la-Gaillarde, France
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Posted November 20th, 2009 - 6:49 pm from Brive-la-Gaillarde, France
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Posted November 20th, 2009 - 9:34 pm by from London, England (Permalink)
You are not nice, you shouldn't laugh at other people, if they are asking about something. There is no stupid questions, the stupidest is the one not asked.

And you should take into account that different countries has different economical system, in some countries people earn more, in some less, in ones things cost more, in some less.

And maybe you know or not(if not i advise you to read something, to refresh your information about the world) that Poland is not a rich country, and we don't earn a lot here.
And as to come to this, in Poland some people can survive like for 40 euros half a month. But taking into account economical system of Hungary and according to my country there is everything more expensive, and I see I have to pay a lot of money(looking at this from my polish point of view)so that is ok, organizers decided it. But at least I would like to know for what. There isn't anything strange about it, I don't know how it is in your countries, but here, If you are going to some party or something there is written a price and what is included like for example(sitting,drink, eating, ticket,dj, something, something)and this way we know what we pay for.
And me personally being on such CS meetings I've never meet such system, so I was asking.

Posted November 21st, 2009 - 10:21 am from Toulouse, France
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Posted November 21st, 2009 - 11:38 am by from Budapest, Hungary (Permalink)
ha ha even he changed his name to Franek to sound more Polish!!!!

let us see the possibilities!!!

See you guys.. will be FUN!!
Franek spent some weeks in Hungry this Summer, we were together on a canoe trip he knows we promise a bit less and deliver more :-) !!

Thanks Benjamin !!! A



Posted November 21st, 2009 - 5:28 pm from Brive-la-Gaillarde, France
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Posted November 21st, 2009 - 6:42 pm from Eindhoven, Netherlands
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Posted November 21st, 2009 - 9:00 pm by from Jakarta, Indonesia (Permalink)
"One of the things I really don't like is that they make the meetings only accesable for the people who pay the 40 euro (correct me if I am wrong, I really hope I am..). For me that is really NOT the CS spirit..."

Say what? What's the point in having a fee if you can join without paying it? That would be a voluntary donation. I agree that the fee is a bit steep; but the fee is there, so unless they've decided on a feeless participation for citizens of development countries or whatever, everyone who would like to participate should pay that fee.

Posted November 21st, 2009 - 11:18 pm from Eindhoven, Netherlands
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Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 12:13 am by from The Hague, Netherlands (Permalink)
we booked 40 euro tickets, we'll see what it gets us. As long as we get into the NYE party and t-shirts, I'm good really... and maybe it's a cool idea to go to the goulash making thing or sthing, I'm just too curious to just buy the 15 euro ticket for the NYE party only....;-)

Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 12:18 am by from Budapest, Hungary (Permalink)
Just to clarify.. we will not control the wristband at the outdoor events of course.. those who sign up to city walks or bath visits Haka workshop etc etc are free to join of course.
We need to control participation of the indoor events, when we had to advance rental fees etc..

Will consider your proposal to book at a later stage the NYE party on line but once we know those who have paid for the full package are protected.

other visits like Opera or Palace of Arts are exclusive departure for the Camp participants, but they have public visits for those who want to go at their own leisure .

Ronald, we know couchsurfers are individuals, and we are unable to meet every individual expectation, our target to make 90 percent absolutely happy and satisfied. We have about 700 advance interests, still a challenging mission I think! back to work! cheers Andras




Posted November 21st, 2009 - 10:35 pm by from Budapest, Hungary (Permalink)
Hi Ronald,
we have to add the goulash workshop, the farewell party, with a band, The internatinal night music equipment, and the Tuesday dinner at the Market hall.. I wrote we are not ready yet with all the cost items.
At the citadel the 15 euros is just the room rental, plus the lights and sounds etc etc..
we wish to add drinks where possible, rest assured will represent a good value!
The BPWC is longer in time. than Berlin was, as we are lucky with the distribution of the free holidays..
As I promised earlier we shall keep you updated with the booking status.
Our books swill be transparent, you are welcome to set up an auditing committee. but I beg you let us stop here..
Let us concentrate on our core mission to organize the best Wintercamp ever!
Sure we shall have fun!
Andras

Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 8:54 am by from Paderborn, Germany (Permalink)
This discussion is interesting cause i think everybody has the right to know where the money has been spend :)
I for myself can´t be there before the 31 so I think there should be an cheaper ticket for CS who can´t spend the whole time there (like Berlin Beach Camp 2009).

Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 10:04 am by from Budapest, Hungary (Permalink)
Hi Markus,
I can just repeat myself, that we are still not ready with every cost item, and that we need to serve the majority of our guests who come and camp with us, once their needs are met we may adjust the structure.
We need to give a downpayment to locations otherwise they will cancel our bookings, New years Eve is the peak of the peak.
See you then on the 31st of December.
A

Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 11:30 am by from Warsaw, Poland (Permalink)
I agree with Ronald 100% at this point, that there should be a choice available for people. I am more than sure that many people would choose Budapest only for the New Years Eve Party and not the whole 6 days holiday, because of many reasons like spending time with family, going to the Austrian Mountains for skiing, etc, etc...so there deffinitely should be 2 variants of entrance fees,
1 - all events
2 - new years eve event

Think, maybe that make even more guests to come, because some people may say, no I wont pay 40 euro and just go for 1 night there .... if there would be a choice everyone would be satisfied and the fun could be even greater for everyone, with more people and overall happiness! :D
Thats my word, I will come anyways if my friend decides to join me =] Must work on it a bit more ... :D
Cheers

Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 12:05 pm by from Krakow, Poland (Permalink)
I agree. For example I'll go to Budapest 31 of December in the morning because I can't go there earlier. And I can't buy ticket only for New Years Eve Party now. I would like to buy this ticket earlier if would be posiible.
Maybe you can do something with that;)

Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 12:07 pm by from Budapest, Hungary (Permalink)
Points taken...A

Posted November 21st, 2009 - 1:42 pm by from London, England (Permalink)
"Izabella, what I can tell you is that meeting Franek is definitely worth every penny! "

Yep I believe you :D For sure.... I will come:P Be aware of me :P:P!! But now I need to think how to have more money to survive there:D So I am trying to combine not to pay for unnecessary things. :P

I am only a poor student:P I hope it will be great :P And I hope I will have time to get money to pay for the ticket:P

Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 6:08 pm by from Paderborn, Germany (Permalink)
Oh yes, it would be great if there were a discount ticket for those who can't stay all the 6 days.

I'm very unhappy not to be able to visit the camp before the 31st, and I really would like to participate in the events after NYE (and also would sleep in the camp)- but 60 Euros is too much for only two and a half days... when all the expensive events (goulash!) are over.

Of course I don't expect to pay only half of the full price, but a slight discount would be fair. Something like (just as an example)
1 day -> 25 EUR
2 days -> 35 EUR
3 days -> 45 EUR
4 days -> ...
5 or 6 days -> ...
like it was at last year's Wintercamp

Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 7:33 pm by from Budapest, Hungary (Permalink)
sorry, we do not have the infrastructure, the manpower for all this.. we could not get the software from Germany, we had to develop a new one from scratch.. maybe next year a new team in a new location will do even better.

I am repeating the third time that once we have accommodated the in house campers and all their needs we shall open up the new years eve party for advance bookings but unable to do more.

Please kindly accept this structure for this year.
Thank you for your understanding and cooperation.
cheers Andras


Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 8:05 pm by from Budapest, Hungary (Permalink)
I just can confirm what András told. Sorrily we had serious problems at the last weeks, I had to take control and do some emergency management. The good thing is, that everything is now right on the track keeping the schedule. To give a brief look into, there was setup a management tool with every task, timeline, team member, etc. But this took lot of time in a very short time.
Abou the price. It was the option to keep the price down for that amount of places, program what the event will include. The detailed list will be placed soon on the website - we just simply did not have to time to do it yet! We also have to do the daily work at our workplace, and on the weekend to take care about our wife, etc...but we work hard on the wintercamp....cu here

David

Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 8:40 pm by from London, England (Permalink)
"sorry, we do not have the infrastructure, the manpower for all this.. we could not get the software from Germany, we had to develop a new one from scratch.. maybe next year a new team in a new location will do even better. "

So do we pay for the software, for organizing events, for your hard and great work :) ? Isn't it a voluntary activity?

And having time is a relative thing:) You don't have time to write details, but for taking money you have? :>

I think that people are happy when they have possibility to meet, and talk in one place. The power is in the people, and in their personality. I am not going to Budapest to see the city but to meet so many wonderful people!!! To say Big Thanks personally to the organizers for their long, and hard and VOLUNTARY job in organizing things, and first and foremost I want to follow their job, and later when i will be older to set an example to other people, and show them how great is such activity, to volunteer.

Cheers, hope you will find a solution, to make us happy :)

Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 9:00 pm by from Budapest, Hungary (Permalink)
Who cannot stand the heat can go out of the kitchen!!!
cheers Andras

Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 9:17 pm by from Budapest, Hungary (Permalink)
Dear Isabelle,

we do it voluntary. Yes, nobody forces for that and we like it. What my spirit breaks, this kind of replies what you write.

It is right, that people have the power inside in them, and they can give you fun - yeah, when they do not have to sit always in a cold place - they will not be wonderful if they are cold, unhappy, or sick - and that is the important thing we have to care about - we reserve places, negotiate prices, competite offers.

Beside that, many of us already spent much money on the whole thing (phone, gas, time, etc) without. We agreed that. That is voluntary.

But if you do not want to understand it, you shall not come to the event, there will be surely better choices for you.

Thanks for the big thanks in the name of the organizers.

I hope next time you will also join a this kind of great project (here or wherever) on the organizers side and then you will answer/handle these questions and problems better.

Regards and good night,

David

Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 10:35 pm by from Krakow, Poland (Permalink)
It would be the best if you do only one thing: allow us to buy tickets only for the New Years Eve Party here on the website. Maybe now it's for you little confusion to change everything and make up discounts and something like that.
And I understand that. I can imagine how hard is to organize everything. But for me (and I think for the rest of people who can't go before 31 of December) it's no problem to find some place to sleep the day after New Years Eve Party.
There are a lot of youth hostels in Budapest and after New Years Eve Party there are a lot of available places.
So, fortunatuly, that's no problem;)
But we would like to be sure that we can join the party and also meet a lot o people and have a good time.
Like Isabelle said, we're not going to Budapest only to see the city but also to meet so many wonderful people.
That's the reason why buing the tickets earlier is so important.
I hope it will be possible;)
Regards;)

Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 10:50 pm from Brive-la-Gaillarde, France
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Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 11:26 pm by from Budapest, Hungary (Permalink)
I am getting pissed about all these comments about the prices and discounts asking... Keep in mind, STUFFS ARE NOT FREE!!! and everything has a price...

I know personally the organizers and the great job they are doing investing their times, money and i can assure you they are not taking any profit on that..

I am living here and like many of you i wont stay at the camp, but i want to participate in the NYE party so i will pay the 40 euros and i will get a free T shirt :) lol, in a lot of places only the NYE will be more expansive than that...

Why dont you think like for example, the summer festivals, where even if you just want to see a band, you have to pay for all the other concerts that day...

Now, please stop! the organizers and moderators have more stuffs to do than keep replying the same... they will put the details when they can, and they will do some discounts IF they can...

And Izabela, if posts like
"And having time is a relative thing:) You don't have time to write details, but for taking money you have?"
are coming too often, i guess they will need to increase the prices to go to psi´s to get cured from the stress of trying to be nice in replying to such stupid posts....


Good night to everyone!





Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 11:39 pm from Berlin, Germany
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Posted November 23rd, 2009 - 2:45 am by from Chennai, India (Permalink)
@ MARYBUDA : Well Said ! Hope this puts an end to all the bickering that has been happening in this thread for the past few days which totally saps the enthusiasm of the organisers to do better things.

Let us give the guys a break who are putting in their heart and soul to make this camp into a grand success by their tireless work and not harass them unnecessarily lest they get tired of this and walk away.

Good Day to all of you and have a Good Week too !

Ciao !



Posted November 22nd, 2009 - 10:30 pm from Brive-la-Gaillarde, France
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Posted November 23rd, 2009 - 5:33 am by from Oss, Netherlands (Permalink)
At every big meeting where I went to there were discussions and complaints about the money they asked for it.
Even in 2006 when I went to the Warsaw wintercamp I heared the same kind of story's and complaints from people.

At that time it was only possible to pay to an Iban-number I remember that costs was like 15 euro that time though my transaction costs afterwards were 25 euro wich I had to pay to my bank for the international transfer.

As we are talking about international money transfer people that pay should also count that some percents of the money will disapearing in the bank though we can't work without them.

I would like it if everyone gives the organisers in the warsaw camp our trust to make them have a chance to make it to become great to all of us.

After most of the camps in the past I often heared that the organiser had to add 500 euro's or more of their own money caused by miscalculations in the beginning.

Not all meeting organisers are good financial professionals and in every event there are risks that also need to be covered.

If much money is left "after" the camp and if they donate this to a enviromental organisation or fund a next wintercamp with that would even be fine to me.

Still at many meetings I often hear people complaining that they have to pay 10 15 or 20 euro for attending while you never hear them about the 50 euro they spend on drinks themselves.

Just displaying my feeling about this right now.

@Izabela Please give them our trust and if they buy a nice car afterwards from the money than I think we have all the right to complain or ask some money back. Hopefully also your experiences will be so great that you forget that you payed that 40 euro.

Posted November 23rd, 2009 - 11:11 am by from Paderborn, Germany (Permalink)
Maikel,

in general I agree on with you. We should be thankful to all the Budapest volunteers who put a lot of time and energy into organizing everything.

My complaint was not about mistrust - I think 60 Euros is quite OK for 6 eventful days; life is expensive nowadays and I really don't believe the organizers make us pay a "underhand salary" to them. I won't complain about 10 Euros more or less - it's just that it doesn't feel fair to me that I must pay the full amount for only 2 days. I booked cheap train tickets to HU some weeks ago and now I'm very disappointed about "not being able" to take part in the camp (sorry, but I will not pay for anything if I feel fooled with it).

Unfortunately it's too late for a discussion about this topic. I made my decision, and hopefully I'll meet some of you outside the camp.

Nevertheless: a big thank you to the organizers for all the volunteer work, and please don't feel offended by all our complaints. You can never please everybody.

Posted November 23rd, 2009 - 9:56 pm from Eindhoven, Netherlands
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Posted November 23rd, 2009 - 10:50 pm by from Budapest, Hungary (Permalink)
Exactly!!!!!! thank you for the clarification, and the time you have spent making this valuable posting!

Dear Ronald.
I repeat... once we know that all who wanted to stay in the camp and wanted to book the whole program are served, we shall open the bookings for just the party..

If you look at the Event booking s we have like 500 people saying yes ..and for the party itself only around 60.
We expect more bookings December salary day..

We have received close to 100 on line registrations in advance by now, many bank transfer are on the way..

thanks again, cheers Andras

Posted January 2nd, 2010 - 1:20 am by from Oss, Netherlands (Permalink)
I must comment that in my conclusion the price for attending people that booked without the accomedation was way to high.

on arrival/registration I only got a t-shirt and got no discount vouchers at all as the only place where my bracelet gave me something was at the entrance to the NYE party dec31 itself.

Posted January 2nd, 2010 - 3:12 pm from Bangkok, Thailand
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Posted January 4th, 2010 - 2:05 pm by from Frankfurt am Main, Germany (Permalink)
the price was not too high...
if you missed the soup-dinner, the goulash workshop, the hot wine and all the other things included: it's your bussiness...
nobody is forced to attent any camp!
so if the the price is too high for you: stay home!
i'm full of trust the organizers did a great job with all the money they spend for this great party.
pay a bit of respect for their efforts and the energy they invested!
we payed 10€/day - in our local hostel you pay €23/day for a dorm and just get a louzy bed under a farthing neighbour.
this penny counting discussions always are sucking.
sorry for my harsh answer, but this had to be said.
thanks again for the great camp!
my suggestion if there is any money over: the organizers should meet downtown and get pissed like rats because they where working as we partied.
volker


Posted January 4th, 2010 - 2:22 pm by from Trieste, Italy (Permalink)
thumbs up, Volker :)


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Posted January 6th, 2010 - 12:39 am by from Vienna, Austria (Permalink)
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Posted January 4th, 2010 - 2:38 pm from Berlin, Germany
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Posted January 4th, 2010 - 11:46 pm by from Budapest, Hungary (Permalink)
@Volker, Bravo!! :))

Posted January 5th, 2010 - 10:40 am by from Chennai, India (Permalink)
@ Volker Kohler : Fantastic and ingenuous riposte from you !!!!.

" My suggestion if there is any money over: the organizers should meet downtown and get pissed like rats because they where working as we partied "

- Mr. Volker : A classic Masterpiece Mate ! But absolutely true as the organisers must have worked their arses off for the smooth organisation of an event of this proportion !
-----------------------------------------------------------

@ Maikel Lourenssen : Your post on Nov 23rd in the same forum and your post on January 2nd shows two distinct sides of your personality and observation .
-----------------------------------------------------------

@ Everybody : It was unfortunate that I had to miss this great event owing to my personal problems. Wish I was there and let my hair down a bit for those days. Nevertheless guess you folks had a great time under all those layers and layers of clothing. Just Kidding !

Peace be with you all!


Babu ( Would sincerely request Mr. Andras for some photographs of the Downtown Drinking Binge !!! )

Posted January 5th, 2010 - 12:10 pm from Lima, Peru
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Posted January 5th, 2010 - 12:23 pm by from Budapest, Hungary (Permalink)
"...and never forget you always need a puffer. Somebody has to sign all the contracts and this person doesn'T want to pay for the WinterCamp alone if the money wasn't enough!"

Bullseye!
That is a major project problem by this kind of events. Try to find out _before_ the event how many people will finally attend. Generally some average weighting (worst/average*4/best // divided 6 ) was used.

That was the responsibility which was hard to take, but we had to. You have to also keep the camp when something bad happens, e.g. totally 150 people attends.

David

Posted January 5th, 2010 - 11:44 pm from Eindhoven, Netherlands
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Posted January 6th, 2010 - 12:43 am by from Vienna, Austria (Permalink)
- no Champagne at the NYE Party: My Money, Memory & Pictures tell me something different ... there was Sparkling Wine available, just not on the Menu ... Hungarian Barpeople don't bite ... they answer Questions if you have some :)
- half an hour to the Camp: Ohh c'mmon at Berlin Beach Camp you have to travel around an hour to get to the Inner City
- more expensive prices @ NYE: Hungary is still cheaper than the Netherlands ... so even the more expensive Location was probably cheaper and I liked it to have a really special Location for NYE

Who cares about the Costs and so on ... I'm sure the Organizers don't make personal profit out of it and even if they would it was heavy work for them and they did a great Job :)

Stefan

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Posted January 6th, 2010 - 12:55 am by from Vienna, Austria (Permalink)
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Posted January 6th, 2010 - 1:05 am by from Vienna, Austria (Permalink)
Also no champagne should be read as: not allowed to bring any champagne.
----

Ahh yeah OK that's true, at least a Bottle or so could have been nice to bring with you.
And the upper floor Barkeeper was the one who answered my Question about Champagne :)


Ah yes? So we start making profit with CS Events now? Good to know/hear/read, perhaps I'll stark organizing some for profit stuff, too...
---
If the Profit stays in the Community it's not that much of a Problem... you can never calculate to end up with Zero ... Vienna Calling 2009 we were scared like hell to end up with a big fat loss (which could easily have been the case if Weather wouldn't have been nice)

And the cool undeground Bars don't fit 700 People. Also at the Bakelit Hangar it would have gotten crowded with 700 People.
Big Locations are not easy to find and not always the cheapest ones.

Stefan

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Posted January 6th, 2010 - 1:16 am by from Vienna, Austria (Permalink)
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Posted January 6th, 2010 - 1:47 am by from Vienna, Austria (Permalink)
I paid nothing for the Answer, but 4000 HUF per Bottle of Sparkling Wine :)

And I didn't say something about Personal (monetary) Profit ... just about Profit in General.

Citadella Cafe is a Cafe and the Location were we were was the Partylocation. If I go to a Cafe in the inner City of Vienna I pay 3.3 € for a Beer, if I go to Fledermaus or some other Club I pay 4.4 € for a Beer. Clubs/Partylocations are more expensive with Beerprice...it's this way in all Countries probably :)

Entrance was only low at Vienna Calling because we didn't pay much for the Location. Don't know if we can keep this for 2010 also ... Locations in Vienna cost around 1500 € (probably also not that much cheaper in Budapest)... and all you get is the Room, Light & Sound Equipment ... additionally they Profit from the Drinks.

Stefan

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Posted January 6th, 2010 - 2:00 am by from Vienna, Austria (Permalink)
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Posted January 6th, 2010 - 9:23 am by from Frankfurt am Main, Germany (Permalink)
poor discussion,
the ny-party place seemed to me like a night club/discoteque, don't know about nowerdays prices in alike locations in vienna and elsewhere, but clubs in frankfurt are more than twice the price for beer, not to talk about wine and champagne...
as i said before, nobody is forced to attent to any party by signing in to cs!
on the other hand side, every one is free to organize a camp, even a cheap one.
what about having a wintercamp in the netherlands or austria for 5€/6days (7€ with accomandation)?
have fun organizing
volker
ps. many (non money sick) friends of myne just stayed for two or three nights and payed the full monty of 60, but did not complein...
i would name this solidarity with the cs philosophy

Posted January 6th, 2010 - 12:04 pm from Lima, Peru
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Posted January 6th, 2010 - 12:46 pm by from Montreal, Canada (Permalink)
The criticism is easy but the art is difficult

think about this
and i agree organize the next winter camp and like this we can compare one year after

but all this is boring stop and continu and private
and "I" hope to not see you on next one if you have no respect

good luck & good trip for never

KÖSZÖNÖM SZEPEN to the team, all the people i met & so sorry for the others !!!!!

Posted January 6th, 2010 - 1:54 pm from Munich, Germany
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Posted January 6th, 2010 - 3:23 pm by from Frankfurt am Main, Germany (Permalink)
it's, in my poor opinion, not snobbish to say: if i can not afford something, i don't do it, it's just reality and no reason to complain...
there have been many great camps i could not afford to go and i still attend some others i can...
but please stop this complaining about and bashing of our great budapest organizer gang and their great work.
feel free to do one yourself!
or, like flo said, ask gothi about riga or others who where left after other camps with a big mass and loss...
it's easy to complain about something you have never done yourself...

Posted January 6th, 2010 - 4:42 pm from Bangkok, Thailand
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Posted January 6th, 2010 - 6:03 pm by from Ludwigshafen am Rhein, Germany (Permalink)
i think there have been good reasons to calculate the price we had now. For me it was ok and i think for more or less everyone who CAMPED with the full package it was a very good deal. If you decided to stay outside the Camp and pay for your location 20 EUR or elese...you are much more higher with your total costs then to stay in the camp. Ok maybe you had a nice host for free, then you saved the 20 EUR. With your 40 EUR you could attend all parties in Bakelit and the party too. So if for you was the way to long to go to Bakelit, its your problem. I had the same way to go back after the pubcrwal in the middle of the night and people if you belive it or not, it took a bus back from the New Years eve party and it stopped directly in the middle of the night infront of bakelit. The only thing you have to ask some of the organisers (i asked Andras), where is the next bus stop and how i reach with it the Camp again. And with me was a bigger group going back by bus. I think it make a big difference between staying a few days in the camp or get hosted outside. Until i only hear from people who didnt camp complaints, all others seemed to be satisfied with the deal. Also the breafest buffet every morning for additional 3 EUR was a very good deal and i wont miss it!
Also noone can change something after the camp now, so its more or less not worth to complain now about prices, locations. Every Wintercamp until was organised in another way, had different costs, different locations for the party etc. So i think it doesnt make sence to compare the Winercamps at all.

Posted January 6th, 2010 - 9:26 pm from Eindhoven, Netherlands
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Posted January 6th, 2010 - 10:26 pm by from Oss, Netherlands (Permalink)
Hi everyone,
First of all I Apologize for the first post that I made in this group I didn’t want to upset anyone. I also apologize for visiting this event as if I wouldn’t have went there probably this post was never made by me.

I didn’t talk about my experience during the camp as I had to cool down myself about this. Kaya you liked it and I didn’t want to spoil anyone’s mood more though mine was already spoiled at that moment.

Anyway I have respect for the organization and don’t have the feeling that they made much profit at all. I talked about this with Andras already but during the event I got the feeling that I had to write this.
As in august I didn’t know how the accommodation was arranged I booked an apartment for 3 reasons:
1- To have a quiet place to sleep
2- Leave probably cheap place for someone that has less money to spend on this trip
3- Be able to host a last minute sign up for in case if all space is sold out.

As I couldn’t be guaranteed that there were tickets for NYE only I booked the 40 euro deal and attend at a few sub events.
Normally when I go to events all sub events that are not for free are asked an extra payment which is always OK in my opinion. If you buy a package travel at a travel agent excursions are always optional.
Though in CS none of us are professional organizers and that’s why there also should be some trust in them in case something goes wrong and things are not planned optimal.

In my feeling the location the citadel could be compared with having the NYE party on top of the Eifel tower of Paris which is of course never cheap and there.
The 6 day package including hosting is of course a very cheap and good deal as these people spent less than 15 euro per day on events and hosting and in that case I wouldn’t have complained about this price. Though for people that spend 30 euro per night apart from the 40 euro makes this story kind of different.

As I was the only person that had posted this during the camp It even made me sadder when people said: If you don’t like it why don’t you go home. (I travelled 1400 km to get there) So getting home during the event was not really possible for me but I followed the advice from Volkert and spent 200 euro on getting the first possible flight home. Also at the events that I could find I didn’t talk to anyone anymore about my doubts to not spoil the fun for others that really don’t even care about my posting.

Like Nagelfar I was not just thinking about myself but about all those people that travelled from places where the average income is about 100 euro per month that also did make it to Budapest.

Reflecting to the Netherlands what some people did I can tell you that at many places you can have a good beer for less than 2,50 in the Netherlands (only place where you can’t find that is in Amsterdam/Rotterdam).

I think that I made myself the most annoying couchsurfer of this NYE party and I agree with Volkert that if I knew this beforehand I would have stayed home and also advised the 8 other people that came (because of my advice) to also stay home that didn’t post here as they were afraid of getting the same critics that I got here.

I have lot of respect for all the organizers that really worked their ass of and if they make money out of it I trust them that this will be spent in a good way (told that to Andras already) and I don’t want a refund either as I rather prefer them to spend it in new upcoming CS events.

In every good bar has a menu with their drinks and if things are not on the menu it is normal to not bother the bartender with asking for things that they probably might not have. So as Champagne was not on the menu means that they or didn’t sell it or didn’t want to sell it or that the price would have been so ridiculous that people probably wouldn’t spend that much for it anyway. Though it was a NYE party and not just a normal bar meeting. And the way they told me about not having red-bull didn’t make me feeling good for having other “requests” that were not on the menu.

I don’t want to act popular with my posts as it is harder to write about not-so-nice experiences in a way that it still sounds positive than not writing about it all and of course it’s much nicer to write how fantastic everything was.

The people that were at the meetings were fantastic and the atmosphere was like that as well but for Volkert and all other people that disagree with me next meetings in Budapest will be much better as I won’t be coming to Budapest again.
It took me some days to digest all my experiences and respect for the organizers without any sarcasm (sometimes my post are seen as sarcastic).

Greetings,
Maikel

Posted January 7th, 2010 - 1:08 am by from Budapest, Hungary (Permalink)
After holding back our horses for a few days, we have compiled a sort of assessment.
We wanted to create a community and indirectly promote the stay at the camp and that people would join as many events as possible.. we managed to infiltrate some culture to the party scene that was well received.
The idea was not to create a hostel and not to create a package tour but to get people together form 40 countries or so and stay together build up relations exchange views and traditions.
I told Maikel that in my opinion he de-socialized himself from the Camp itself.. he booked an FIT trip as they say in tourism . own transport accommodation ready to buy guaranteed departure sightseeing tours,
it started that he took a 23E /express/ bus that did not stop at Bakelit while we said the correct bus is 23, hundreds of people had no major problem finding it.
99% of the people had hosts or at least a hostel receptionist to overcome the far from perfect flyers we produced that was not proof read. big mistake I admit.
My number and others were published and many used it for lost items directions.
hope Maikel would change his mind and return in the summer, when I could show him around could tell the dozens of urban legends taped sightseeing tours do not include.
All in all maybe this was not the cheapest of all CS events but managed to provide positive experiences more than a few disappointments.. and this is what CS is all about .. right???
Off to vacation / do not worry... free tickets from my airline... Zoltan will carry on the main communication line .. cheers and hugs Andras



Posted January 7th, 2010 - 2:17 pm from Berlin, Germany
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